Editor’s Note: Five years ago we had an idea. Being a woman-owned publication, it made sense to us to celebrate women who were making a difference in the industries we cover. So, we started a “little” feature for Women’s History Month called “Reel Women.” To say it blossomed into something special would be a vast understatement. It exploded. Over the last four years, we have gotten to know leaders, mentors and visionaries from a variety of creative industries. We have learned about their ups. And how they get back up after being down. This is our 5th Annual REEL WOMEN. For the month of March, let us introduce you to some very special women like actor, writer, producer and everything else, Constance Zaytoun.
Constance Zaytoun is an actor, VO artist, writer, on-camera host and producer. Professional credits include FBI: Most Wanted, Gossip Girl, and Petra Norton on Hulu’s upcoming series Saint X.
Through her production company founded with her partner Marc Weitz, Constance presents theatre in New York City and created the award-winning comedy-drama-reality series, Constance Cooks.
During the pandemic, she also produced Wednesday Fare, weekly cooking segments for IGTV. Dr. Zaytoun (!) is also a published author with a Masters in feminist performance from New York University and a Ph.D. in theatre studies from CUNY Graduate Center.
Let’s meet Constance.
What’s your origin story?
I grew up in North Carolina, the youngest of nine children. All four of my grandparents emigrated to North Carolina from Lebanon, but I never learned the language. What I did learn was cooking! With a nine-year gap between child-number-8 and myself, I hung out a lot in our kitchen watching my mother and our housekeeper cook. My favorite was when my mother hosted a dinner or cocktail party. I stayed in the kitchen and watched all the preparations, or I sat beside the bartender “helping.” Eventually, as I got older, I also served at the table.
So today I can just as easily make Lebanese staples such as labneh, babaganoush, and kibbeh, as I can southern classics, like fried chicken, pimiento cheese, or buttermilk biscuits. When I was in grad school here in New York writing my dissertation on feminist art and performance, I often interviewed artists over a homemade dinner.
It put them at ease and gave us a point of connection that made the conversation flow. That idea of interviewing artists and cooking for them ultimately became the origin for Constance Cooks, the TV show I created with my spouse, Marc Weitz.
More than the cooking though, the south was a very interesting culture for me to navigate. Most people didn’t consider my family Caucasian, nor were we considered Christian, even though we were Roman Catholic. Back then, in the Bible Belt, calling yourself Catholic was like saying you had three heads! I felt my “otherness” very acutely, though I barely understood how to claim it.
So to overcome that “you do not belong here” feeling, I grew into a high-achieving people-pleaser, and directly out of college I took a corporate job in New York. It took a clinical depression and years of therapy to undo the damage of people-pleasing expectations, and I finally had the courage to bear the disappointment of my family and attend graduate school in performance & theatre studies.
How did you get into acting, writing & producing?
Ironically, my family is to blame, but it’s been a long and twisty road! My sister took me to my very first play when I was six. It was a community theatre production of Dracula, and the space was small. Well, holy moly! I was TERRIFIED, and remained that way for over a year. I was petrified that Dracula was coming to bite my neck, so I had to make ‘deals’ with my nightly activities—like no showers, only baths, so I could hear him coming.
And I had to sleep with my arm around my neck and my sheets pulled up under my chin. My mother finally sat me down and explained to me what theatre was and how wonderful it was that actors can perform make-believe like that live in front of an audience. I guess I believed her, but I still slept with my arm around my neck!
But that was it – the theatre bug was planted. Still, though I wanted to act, I was only encouraged to play classical piano. Then, in my first year of college, I talked my way into an upper-level modern theatre class because I heard the professor was fantastic. And he was! Not only did I learn to read plays for the first time, but I was also cast in student productions.
And still, even though deep in my heart I wanted to be an actor, without support I thought at least I could be a theatre scholar and surround myself with the art form. At NYU I discovered there were many folx who claimed themselves as artist/scholar hyphenates, and so I tried to do both for many, many years. However teaching took up most of my time and energy, with little left over to produce, write, or act.
But in 2014, after performing in an Off-Broadway production of Paula Vogel’s And Baby Makes Seven, the penny dropped. I was working as an adjunct professor in several theatre programs, and I thought “why am I making so little money for THIS broken system, when, if I’m going to sacrifice, I’d rather do it for my art!?!” So I resigned all of my teaching positions, took up a gig as a bartender, and I’ve worked the business of being an artist every day since (minus the bartending now!).
Who were your mentors?
I’m not sure I’ve had a serious mentor-mentee relationship, and the one I maybe could point to was toxic. Oy! What I have had are numerous relationships with remarkable teachers, coaches, and friends who have opened my eyes and helped me in many ways.
I always feel so fortunate to have had so many wonderful people touch my life! But first and foremost, I was lucky enough to find a therapist who guided me out of the darkness and helped me find an authentic life. I absolutely owe my life to his brilliance and compassion. The professor whose modern theatre class I first took became a big supporter of mine up until the day he died.
And I have a handful of incredible coaches who have guided me, particularly since I have devoted myself to being an artist full-time, and they are the people I turn to today when I need coaching on audition sides or mindset work in the profession.
I also have the privilege of knowing many artists and scholars who have mentored my feminism, in particular Peggy Phelan and my good friend, Deborah Kass.
Kass especially has been a lighthouse for me. I’ve witnessed the rise and recognition of her artwork, and she never compromises her FEMINIST INSISTENCE on taking space as a woman, as a lesbian, and as a Jewish person.
While there will be others, what do you consider your biggest achievement to date?
The creation of my series—Constance Cooks. That stands out because it really feels like the culmination of the twisty road I’ve traveled to be an artist. In this business it’s so important to give yourself agency and not wait around for others to give you permission to do the work you love.
For many years my partner and I had kicked around the idea of a show drawing on my experience writing my dissertation, where I would interview New York artists and cook for them. We thought of it as a kind of living journal—like Charles Kuralt meets Julia Child.
And then I had one of those shower epiphany moments—”Why do I feel more comfortable supporting the art of others rather than my own?” So I thought what if the show was about a failed academic trying to create an interview/cooking show, and she doesn’t know how? Aside from it just feeling funny, this resonated with me on so many levels.
I could see a lot of my friends still struggling after many years with how to pursue their own dreams. I also saw on social media how many cooking influencers were striving to make it big. And as a proud Gen X’er, our invisibility compared to Gen Z, millennials, and boomers is big topic of conversation these days.
So Marc and I “paid” ourselves for an entire week to write with no distractions. After that we assembled a team, raised money, and produced three episodes. We were fortunate that some amazing artists agreed to work with us during principal photography and post, along with a beautiful acting ensemble that included the talents of Marylouise Burke and Isiah Whitlock, Jr.
Our background was in making theatre, so this was all brand-spankin’ new to us, and boy, did we get an education! We learned even more in post-production and found some really creative ways to make sure our story was told.
And when I saw the final product, I was so grateful to see my story being told for the first time. At its core, the theme of Constance Cooks is my theme—that it’s never too late to start living your authentic life. The pilot episode has won several awards, and now we’re shopping it around to see how much further we can take it.
What drives you to create?
The women I know.
These women occupy in‐between spaces ripe with possibilities, but the path is unclear. Some are confused by Millennials and feel stifled by Baby Boomers. Some are Gen Z just starting out on their own, seeking a path that’s different than what their predecessors took.
I’ve lived in an in‐between space most of my life—as a Lebanese‐American who grew up in the South; as a woman; as one whose voice wasn’t valued, particularly as the youngest of nine kids; and as an actor with a PhD in Feminist Art. In‐between spaces are filled with anxiety, irony, passion, and lots and lots of laughter.
Of course, I’m particularly interested in the women of my generation. Studies show it’s common for middle-aged women to hit the bottom of life’s Happiness Curve, but Gen Xers are finding themselves stuck here longer than any other generation, and we can’t quite figure out how to rise from the bottom of that curve despite our education and awareness.
I mean for goodness sake, most of us are experiencing peri-menopause earlier than the norm, and the information available to help us understand what’s happening with our bodies is murky at best. These are not our winding down years! Most of us have much more we want to accomplish, but we’re unsure how.
Art illuminates a path forward through these liminal spaces. We are in the midst of a cultural revolution moving women/non-binaries and people of color to the center of the conversation. I find so much inspiration working with progressive, talented artists who seek ways to laugh and find connections on this journey.
Award you crave, but haven’t won
An EGOT would be fantastic, but that’s four awards! And anyway I don’t think a Grammy is a realistic dream unless there’s a category for Singing in the Shower. So let’s just say I crave the big TOE – Tony, Oscar, Emmy.
Seriously, award questions always stump me. What matters most to me is recognition from my peers who appreciate the work I do. And I feel fortunate to receive that appreciation on a regular basis—from my agents, coaches, folx on set, colleagues in an acting class, my spouse who helps me self-tape on the regular, and even random people who see my work and reach out to me.
As an artist, and particularly as an actor, I feel I’ve had to cultivate a mindset where the true reward is getting to do this work each and every day. And if I’m not on set or submitting an audition, I find other ways to create or work on my craft. It can be challenging, but for the majority of the time, I truly get a kick out of how far I’ve come since sneaking into that college theatre class. I’m an artist working in New York City. It’s astonishingly sublime!
What shows/movies/songs are doing the best job of portraying strong women on TV?
My favorite ‘strong women on TV’ show right now is Hacks. I’m holding my breath for season three! I’m also anxious to see how Amy Sherman-Palladino concludes …Maisel.
A few years ago I read Joy Press’s fascinating book about women showrunners, and I thought, “Holy shit, the history of women/non-binary showrunners can be contained in a single volume?!” Thank goodness we can point to so many more talents these days with showrunners like Phoebe Waller-Bridge, Issa Rae, Kerry Ehrin, and Quinta Brunson.
And I just worked with Leila Gerstein on her upcoming show, Saint X. I’ve got to believe that our presence will grow and grow as content creators and producers. I continue to be inspired by the work of Shonda Rhimes, Tina Fey, Mindy Kaling, and Jenji Kohan, and I can’t wait to see what Katja Blichfeld does next.
Is there still a boys club?
See above! Look, I actually believe this is a much bigger question. The “boy’s club” is the patriarchy, and you don’t have to be a cis-het-white-man to perpetuate the patriarchy. I’ve been smacked down by many surprising people in my life.
We have to keep shining a light on how the patriarchy is a system of oppression, and I believe that any of us, regardless of how we identify, if we care about sexism, exploitation, and oppression of the disenfranchised, we need to identify as feminists now more than ever.
REELated:
Coffee, Lunch or Happy Hour. Name a famous woman (living or dead) you would like to attend each function with
Oh my, I’ve got a whole day planned!
I’d like to meet Patti Smith for breakfast somewhere in Chelsea. Apart from her artistic genius, I see her as the memory of artists and places in downtown New York from a time when art could really thrive in the City. I feel a strong nostalgia for that time, and I didn’t even live through it!
For lunch, i’d like to take bell hooks to someplace she would have remembered from her time living in the city. hooks’ body of work profoundly affected me. in particular, her book, teaching to transgress, changed my approach as an educator, and i think it should be required reading for all teachers.
OMG, Marlo Thomas agreed to meet me for afternoon tea! Can you believe it?! Apart from wanting to discuss her experiences growing up the daughter of a Lebanese father, I really want to know more of how this trailblazer had the chutzpa to give a copy of The Feminine Mystique to Edgar Scherick, VP of Programming for ABC, to convince him that an unmarried woman pursuing a career could be the protagonist of a network TV show.
After our tea party, I rush home to assemble aperitivo for my guests, S. Epatha Merkerson, Cherry Jones, and Allison Janney. Don’t you want to be at this party?! These actors have been my teachers from afar. I sat in the audience mesmerized as each of them played incredible (Tony-winning) roles on Broadway; and since then, have studied their work in countless in film and TV projects. In particular, I snuck up to New York just to see August Wilson’s The Piano Lesson, and Epatha’s performance blew me away. I know her work helped fuel the fire in my belly to be an actor and move to New York. Cherry and I share an odd connection—we both played the same role 20 years apart in the only two off-Broadway productions of And Baby Makes Seven.
And the magnificent Allison, my goodness, it’s hard to believe there was a time when she struggled to be seen for roles! Each of these fierce women had “casting troubles” to overcome, but obviously they continued to believe in themselves despite the myopia, and they did the work.
After this glorious and enriching day, we all meet at the Village Vanguard to listen to Nina Simone. I think we need to revisit her avant-garde music and activism, something that was instilled in her at a very young age. In 1944, when Nina (then Eunice) was 11 years old and living in Tryon, NC, she was supposed to perform a piano recital for an all-white audience.
Just before she was to start, even though her parents were invited to attend, she noticed them being ushered from their front seats to the back row. So she spoke up from the stage and insisted that, if they expected her to play, her parents better return to the front where she could see them! The host obliged. I seek women like Simone who conjure up courage and confront injustices. I’ve never felt terribly courageous myself, so I feel bolstered and supported by my feminist foremothers and sheroes.
Last year, the Supreme Court ruled against Roe v Wade. What can women in your industry do to defend a woman’s rights?
If you can’t tell from my previous answers, I think we must rejuvenate feminism as a movement. We went dormant for a while starting around 1999, because, sadly, folx didn’t believe it was necessary. I taught a lot of college students during that time and at the beginning of the semester, not one student wanted to identify as a feminist. They couldn’t see the need. And yet here we are.
And as artists we’re facing another round of censorship. I vividly remember the culture wars of the 90s, led largely by my home state’s senator, Jesse Helms, along with the defunding of NEA artists and the vilification of artists as obscene. It was ugly, and for a while, artists and feminists were outraged and fought through their activism and work. We need to reengage that fight.
Until we have true equality and no one is privileged over another, the fight cannot stop. There are many methods to fight as an artist in this industry. We witness so many beautiful examples from the past and present. Personally, I’m inspired by folx like John Waters and Deb Kass.
Their work appropriates a recognizable form (whether in film or in visual art), and then they radicalize the form with a transgressive message. They are working within cultural norms for the purpose of blurring the norms, queering them, subverting them. I’m constantly reminded of Adrienne Rich’s poem: “This is the oppressor’s language yet I need it to talk to you.”
We can do this. The majority of those students I taught did learn that feminism was for them, and I can see the shift in Gen Z and how they approach the world. As cynical as I feel sometimes, I look at those who are following my generation, and I have such hope.
What keeps you up at night?
If I could identify all of those things, maybe I could give my shoulders a break!
It’s a lot. Honestly, I know I’ve not dealt with how to face death. Not my own so much, but those whom I love so dearly. It’s the only thing that is guaranteed to occur in our lives, and while many of us have faiths that we can lean on, I have difficulty managing the sadness and loss.
I also grieve about the lack of compassion and critical thinking that’s so visible these days. I just don’t get it. How can we treat each other so cruelly and vilify each other? We tend to stay in our bubble (one community, one news feed, one religion) and cannot see anything beyond our own purview.
This is why art MUST flourish in society and be supported. The best art starts with an open heart and a thinking mind and awakens us to our folly through self-awareness.
What’s up with Beyoncé being nominated for 4 Best Albums of the year but never winning?
I haven’t a clue! Pop culture is often lost on me. I grew up listening to the music of my older siblings, so my musical tastes have always been slightly out of step with my peers. My Pandora channels are Shirley Bassey, Burt Bacharach, and Oscar Peterson. I don’t even have a Spotify account!
Maybe Beyoncé’s record-breaking number of Grammys won offer her a bit of solace. Maybe. But the best spin I have is that her star is too too bright, and everyone knows her tremendous work and talent far-exceed the confines of that particular award.
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